[linux-dvb] extra switch for tzap

Uwe Bugla uwe.bugla at gmx.de
Thu Jul 19 16:26:52 CEST 2007


Am Donnerstag, 19. Juli 2007 16:25:38 schrieben Sie:
> Am Donnerstag, 19. Juli 2007 16:19:17 schrieben Sie:
> > Am Donnerstag, 19. Juli 2007 12:35:14 schrieben Sie:
> > > Le mercredi 18 juillet 2007 19:20, Uwe Bugla a écrit :
> > > > Am Mittwoch, 18. Juli 2007 17:21:07 schrieben Sie:
> > > > > Le mercredi 18 juillet 2007 16:13, Uwe Bugla a écrit :
> > > > > > 2. Kaffeine's channel lists should not be sorted by a couple of
> > > > > > numbers that absolutely do not make any sense.
> > > > > > The sorting should be alphabetically in the first place, then
> > > > > > using numbers. In a kaffeine channel list it's quite horrible to
> > > > > > find a desired channel that you want to watch.
> > > >
> > > > Dear Christophe, first of all a thousands of thanks for your pretty
> > > > nice hints :)
> > >
> > > np :)
> > >
> > > > > You can click on list headers to set sorting.
> > > > > Numbers are quite useful and easy to remember (at least for most
> > > > > viewed channels). You can change a channel' number by selecting the
> > > > > channel in list then clicking again to edit.
> > > > > Anyway, i don't know of any good method to quickly find a channel
> > > > > in a list of thousands :)
> > > >
> > > > The alphabetic order is the most reliable one, no matter if the total
> > > > number of channels is 10, 100 or even 1000 or more.
> > >
> > > I guess it's a matter of taste, i personnaly prefer number sorting ...
> > >
> > > > As an addition a bookmark system to sub-categorize the found channels
> > > > would be "close to perfection." :)
> > >
> > > This one i don't get. Could you explain your idea?
> >
> > A bookmark can look like this (take german channels f. ex.):
> >
> > ___Erste___	followed by channels like:
> > Das Erste
> > Eins Plus
> > Eins Extra
> > Eins Festival
> >
> > ___Private___
> > RTL Television
> > RTL 2
> >
> > etc. .......
> >
> > Thus you can set up some sub-order in an endless list of thousands of
> > channels. If you present the bookmarks in a vertical order you can omit
> > the ordering numbers for the channels.
> >
> > > > As kaffeine is not too well documented :( the alphabetic order only
> > > > does appear in the editor mode, not in the watching TV or radio mode.
> > >
> > > Headers sorting is quite standard however.
> >
> > Thank you! I already found the clue by intuition. :)
> >
> > > > > So you may want to delete useless channels (take a look,
> > > > > you will find a lot :) to reduce the list length.
> > > >
> > > > This also should be done automatically (double and triple
> > > > appearances, channels without a valid name appearing as "unknown"
> > > > etc.).
> > > > The primary direction should be: as little user inputs as necessary.
> > >
> > > That was the case in previous versions, but then users complained about
> > > missing channels :)
> >
> > Lesson 1: Do never listen to crash test dummies! :)
> >
> > To automatically delete double and triple appearances may be in fact
> > harmful sometimes, but there is no discussion about "unknown" channels,
> > or is there any?
> >
> > > > > You can also take advantage of categories to group channels and so
> > > > > deal with smaller lists.
> > > >
> > > > Never even tried that as I am missing features like this one in a
> > > > proper documentation.
> > >
> > > Quoting the handbook:
> > > "You can arrange your channels in categories. To create a new category,
> > > right click in the icon view to get a popup menu. Now, drag a channel
> > > name and drop it on the desired category' icon. To remove a channel
> > > from a category, drop it on the "All" icon. Right click on an icon to
> > > delete that category or change icon."
> >
> > Thanks! Am gonna look that up. I am just too lazy to read docus
> > sometimes.
> >
> > > Not perfect, but at least the category feature is mentioned ;)
> > >
> > > > > P.S.
> > > > > Kaffeine svn has a search field in channels list.
> > > >
> > > > P. S.: femonspeak is real working fine. If I find some time to do I
> > > > will extend the spoken wav-part by two other core languages: German
> > > > and French. Then will produce a Debian package to imply that tool
> > > > into my TCL/TK project I am busily working on (which is trilingual at
> > > > the current state of development).
> > >
> > > Yes, it works fine, i use it when i'm on the roof to adjust the dish !
> > > (with max volume and opened window :)
> >
> > YUP! But only using aplay (alsaplayer), never using play from sox!
> > Using sox I was not successful at all!
> >
> > > > Uwe
> > > >
> > > > Master question 1:
> > > > When I run a kaffeine channel scan I never stumble across "filter
> > > > timeout pid" errors.
> > > >
> > > > When I do the same with "scan" out of the dvb-utils-package, filter
> > > > timeouts appear very often and the scan result is neither mediocre
> > > > nor even reliable, with or without the parameter -5. It's just utmost
> > > > "crappy"!
> > > >
> > > > So please where is the clue in kaffeine's source code that makes its
> > > > channel scan perform so well and reliable (well: I would not say
> > > > perfect, but still far much better than "scan" ever was!)?
> > >
> > > Hm, it could be particular to your device/driver, cause here scan is
> > > still a reference.
> >
> > I have offered any kind of help for improving the (next generation)
> > driver for my specific card, which you can download here:
> > http://www.thadathil.net. It's name is cx878.
> > Although many people gave some hints and tried to be helpful (Greg
> > Kroah-Hartman, Markus Rechberger) nothing has happened for at least two
> > months now - big promises, but no deeds!
> > Lots of time for chat at http://www.linuxtv.org/irc/linuxtv/, but no time
> > for producing a good driver, very selfish, even appearing to treat the
> > driver code like his personal property allowing nobody to mix in "his
> > privacy code affairs" (like Trent Piepho for instance), not reliable at
> > all, ignoring user requests as a kind of favourite sport:
> >
> > This is what you call a "maintainer" here at linuxtv.org!
> >
> > > I think now kaffeine' scan is as good as dvbscan, but i won't
> > > say it's better. (at least dvbscan supports atsc, what kaffeine
> > > doesn't)
> >
> > dvbscan (by Andrew Mc Quincey) can only be used for DVB-T, not for DVB-S.
> > scan can be used for all three (DVB-S, DVB-T, DVB-C).
> > But its pain is:
> > It does what it wants, and that means:
> > If you spend 4 walkthroughs you will receive four different sizes of the
> > dumped "channels.conf" file.
> > Every time the scan procedure suffers a "filter timeout pid" when one
> > specific transponder is being treated you can throw the dump result to
> > /dev/null as it will be highly incomplete!
> >
> > This problem has been documented for at least 2 years now, but there is
> > noone among the "illustrous" linuxtv.org gatekeepers consacring some time
> > to fix that damn issue! :(
> >
> > So would you call THAT a reference? You're kidding, aren't you?
> >
> > As an intermediate solution I will establish a very complicated
> > frequency-based "list scan" as part of my TCL/TTK project which is:
> > a. using a list of 76 transponders in case of Astra-19.2E
> > b. adding a resume feature for timeout transponders in order to complete
> > the result list. It's a horrible procedure, and it is time consuming like
> > hell, but I do not see any alternative to improve the quality of the scan
> > result!
> >
> > :(
> > :
> > > (The main difference between dvbscan and kaffeine is that kaffeine
> > > filters one pid at a time (+ the nit pid in a second  thread) while
> > > dvbscan creates up to 32 (iirc), so dvbscan is a bit faster, but maybe
> > > your device/driver doesn't like it.)
> >
> > 1. That sounds VERY interesting! so please WHERE in scan's source code
> > can I reduce the pid filtering to ONE PID and how. I do not call myself a
> > programmer, so can you please give me a hint where I can find the
> > appropriate sections in latest "scan.c" to patch that thing?
> > It indeed would save me a lot of pain if I only knew where to look at and
> > what to patch! :)
> >
> > 2. As I said already I know that the kernel driver for my specific DVB-S
> > card is crap. After all it's consuming RAM like hell in coherence with a
> > lot of "crappy" dependencies, not regarding the horrible CPU
> > consommation! But what can you do if you're dependent on moody people
> > like Manu Abraham? Switch to another card or what?
> >
> > > > Master question 2:
> > > > In a channel scan result there are channels that are declared CA but
> > > > are FTA and vice versa.
> > > > How can this be corrected automatically?
> > >
> > > It's a well known problem, and i can't see any reliable solution apart
> > > that blaming providers.
> >
> > That won't help (bureaucracy side effects and lazyness phenomenon) :(
> >
> > > It would be possible to check for CA descriptors in PMT, but even some
> > > channels are unencrypted while PMT claim it is !!
> > >
> > > > My proposal would be:
> > > > List the channels by SID in a database or something similar, then
> > > > correcting the CA-flag automatically.
> > >
> > > (SID is not unique through a network, one would need a
> > > NetworkID/TransportStreamID/ServiceID combination to uniquely identify
> > > a channel)
> >
> > OK, didn't know that - Thanks! But SID is unique within a certain
> > satellite hopefully?
> >
> > So it wouldn't be possible to collect the known "faulty" channels sorted
> > by satellite in a database and then correcting the wrong flag
> > automatically?
> >
> > Lots of Regards
> >
> > Uwe





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